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  1. #1
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    AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    You've heard of ESRB RATINGS, well how about an AntiCheat Rating for Games, that is, a way for those who might purchase a game, to know quickly how good the potential protection will be. Essentially, what's the point of getting involved in a game if you know that there's going to be little or no protection. The more protection the better the investment in your time and money.

    So, it might work to have a logo that can be applied to game boxes and on websites, that states, what an international organization, like, hmmm, HackHunters, thinks the rating would be on a scale of 1 to 10 (being the best).

    What do you think?

    I think well protected games might adopt it if they learn that people are asking for and expecting the rating, as it will be good for sales.

    I think those who don't build in protection, will reconsider.

    I think it will send a message to would-be future cheaters that it is an important issue...

    I think it would be good for secondary services like ACI, AON, PBBans PsB and others as they will be consulted with and have their services an integral part of future gaming, in order to increase a game's AC rank.

    Anyone else?





  2. #2


    Re: ACO RATING

    It's certainly a good idea, but obviously the more popular a game is the more cheaters there will be, thus the less safe as more people will be developing hacks. And also it will be virtually impossible to give a game a 10 rating...

  3. #3
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    Re: ACO RATING


    What I've found is less popular games get inundated with a greater percentage of cheaters, because it's not protected and nothing can be done about it, which ultimately kills the game completely. Because they are less popular there is a lack of incentive to invest in protection. Crysis is an example... it is PB enabled, but there is a problem with Vista users, so many servers don't run PB... and Crysis/PunkBuster isn't willing to invest on a game with a small share of gamers to fix the problem.

    There's also the aspect of confidence. I remember quiting COD2 for a long period because I questioned the credibility of the AntiCheat. What I found later is there is a fault in the game engine that gives a certain playing style an advantage which had nothing to do with the AntiCheat. Still, credibility is an issue and games that offer no AntiCheat, or very weak protection lose credibility and players.

    This program is about building confidence in gamers, so they give a game they might not consider a try and to feel confident about playing it for a longer period of time. It also reinforces the importance of AntiCheat protection to the individual player, so they seek it's use more often.

    ---
    I've been trying to think of a way of ranking based on Anti Cheat protection, it would be hard to do so, but not impossible if every year the system was reviewed for changes in the industry.

    What I've noticed on most game websites are the following logo's at the bottom:

    Expected and required...

    That is one ugly graphic, but as a requirement game developers don't have a choice. One could argue both ways as to whether it helps sell games or not.

    and this one which implies that the game is graphically rich, used to attract customers, seen on many game websites:



    This is a graphic I've always liked... red dot (i.e. primary color), shiny and eye catching. Something similar I think Game Manufacturers would be willing to post if they thought it would help sell games.



    I think if we made a logo, that stated a rating, and the name of the game to make it personal and specific (linking the rating to the actual game) and left all other info off, except that it is an AntiCheat Rating... then when clicked on have a (HackHunters or maybe a new organization) page for that game that explains the rating and it's relationship to other game ratings (kind of like the effeciency ratings for appliances), that it might be attractive enough of thing that game developers would include.

    Perhaps the ratings could be like this:

    10
    4

    where the top number represents if it is protected by PunkBuster (or other) as a core AntiCheat and the bottom number represents how many secondary ACO's support the game.

    Maybe instead of a top number, it could be something like this: PB (means enabled); PB (means not enabled); and other core AntiCheats could also be listed this way. So one might end up with something like:

    PB GC
    4

    In fact, if we set up a form, where game manufacturers could simply type in the expected AntiCheat protection, updating it as more ACO's create protection for the game... and this form generated a webpage with the data, along with a logo that showed the rating, most of the work could be done automatically. The only thing left to manage would be a confirmation of the information provided.




  4. #4
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    Re: ACO RATING

    To carry this idea one step further, I need help from those who know more than I about some of the other AntiCheat systems available.

    Okay to start...

    PB (EvenBalance's PunkBuster) is a CORE AntiCheat component in that other ACO's can use it to make their software work.

    To write it out graphically for PB core and secondary systems so that we all understand the relationships:
    • PB>PBBans
    • PB>AON
    • PB>PsB
    • PB>ACI


    Who'd I leave out? DMW?

    Are there any other CORE AntiCheat components?

    Are there stand alone components, which work on their own and don't support other ACO type of systems: VAC (VALVE AntiCheat) for example? X-Ray? GV? GGC ? TWL? CDC?

    It's odd, but considering this is fundamental to AntiCheat, knowing how these things fit in the big picture, this might be a great way to help inform people what AntiCheat works for which game.... including what the core components are.

    So please jump in if you know how anyone of these systems work:
    - as a Core element,
    -as a stand alone or
    -as a secondary (and to what) component.



  5. #5


    Re: ACO RATING

    Now does this idea make total sense and should go forward? yes
    Is the required data all there? yes

    It has only 2 issues. For 1 how are we to get to the state that ERSB is. #2 is quite simple and Im surprised this wasnt said, the human mind loves challenges. Without a challenge the mind would go mad. Now if you give a high rating to a game, what do you think happens? The mind will say "Hey, a challenge! Let me show those losers that I can bypass that security like a hot knife through butter." Now what happens, you have trillions of hacks coming out. This will flood the ACs which create a freaking HUGE problem.



    Credit to GeneralAce100

    "Step your game up guys... Show me guys that I didn't make a mistake.  Show me that your worth counting on.  Show me that you can do, what we do." - Melfice_Elstang


  6. #6
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    Re: ACO RATING

    Don't think so... you mean to say that you think hack developers will 'for the challenge presumed to be based off an anti-cheat rating' will go out of their way to produce even more hacks than what they produce now, just to, I suppose, to discredit the rating? Like I should of said, I know that wouldn't happen. As I'm sure you are aware, the number of hacks are generally based on how popular a game is, what platform it plays on, and maybe a few other factors... but I don't want to get off-topic by discussing a tangent.

    As far as ESRB... i think is Federally controlled. There's not much association between what is suggested here and what they do, except that it is a rating system and, they have a logo that gets posted (required).

    ---

    Still seeking information, which has inspired me to clean up our ACO Directory with clearer categories. And Sneaky, they're listed alphabetically... like A, B, C... do you get the point of that?



  7. #7


    Re: ACO RATING

    Well I still have one other problem with this:
    PB is the bot that (most often) finds the cheat and kicks the user. ACI/AON/AASA/PBBans/PsB/etc. then find the kickline in the logs of the servers streaming towards them and then ban, also often based upon screenshots/demos/etc. The problem is that we will always have some leftover percentage of people being kicked for a cheat by PB but not banned, people being innocent but being banned and also we can only say if a certain server is cheat-free, not a game.
    Of course, I may have misunderstood and what you meant was the POSSIBILITY for a game to be cheatfree as long as servers use all available anti-cheat settings.
    And both of them are going to be EXTREMELY hard to classify.

  8. #8
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    Re: ACO RATING

    hey Inferno, i think you've missed the point of this thread.

    It is about creating a rating system, based on games that employ Anti Cheat solutions. It has nothing to do with whether those games are able to create servers that are cheat free.



  9. #9


    Re: ACO RATING

    Ah OK I think I understood now.
    Correct me if wrong but that logo your planning wouldn't actually tell anything about the actual anti-cheat state (i.e. how secure is the game, how hack-free is it) but only about how many ACO's and PB-similar programs support that game? So only the
    Quote Originally Posted by GB
    potential protection
    ?

    If I'm correct about the above, then it wouldn't actually tell you a lot? Or would it? I'm confused, need to think about that!

  10. #10
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    Re: ACO RATING

    Some games have little or no protection... this program would get them to take the issue more seriously I believe.

    2) by having game sites post information regarding AntiCheat on their game websites, it will reinforce the notion, especially to teens who might think that cheating is okay (see other thread on this topic: "We Have Cheat Codes!"), that cheating is not tolerated.

    3) it should help more game titles to sell as noted above (confidence).

    4) it would encourage servers to employ more AntiCheat solutions, as, given the 'fact' that there would be an easy way to know what's available, Admins could do the research to install them on their server... so yes, this is 'potential protection'. Obviously some servers don't even stream PB.

    5) not only will it help Admins understand what's available, but it will also help educate the general gaming public. A more informed public will start asking questions whether the server they're playing on is using 'such and such'. This will encourage servers to do some research on the topic and potentially get them to employ additional AntiCheat measures.


    I think it does do a lot, and, with the information provided, as I outlined above (with a link to a page which provides additional information, like links to the actual ACO, etc.) that it does in effect, also 'tell you a lot'.

    Maybe I should make a mockup or something... seeing is much easier than explaining sometimes....





    But back to my question please................... what are the core systems (like PunkBuster) or put another way, Standalone systems?

    For instance, is DMW standalone, or does it use PunkBuster as a foundation (core)?





    I realize that the way I write you may have to read things twice ... I know that I have to re-read what I write twice, but the message is still there, so try reading twice, and slooooowly



  11. #11


    Re: ACO RATING

    Wahoo I finally understand what you mean!

    As far as I know, PB is the only standalone/core program, all the others are side programs that are either against the EULA (policy) of the game or only function in addition to PB. That being said, I'm mostly referring to AA here, might be different with other games.


    Quote Originally Posted by Edit: definition added by GreenBean
    EULA: Short for End-User License Agreement, the type of license used for most software. An EULA is a legal contract between the manufacturer and/or the author and the end user of an application. The EULA details how the software can and cannot be used and any restrictions that the manufacturer imposes (e.g., most EULA’s of proprietary software prohibit the user from sharing the software with anyone else).
    The EULA also is often referred to as the software license or user license.

  12. #12
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    Re: ACO RATING

    ahhh, a meeting of the minds, now there can be forward movement again



  13. #13


    Re: ACO RATING

    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBean HH
    Don't think so... you mean to say that you think hack developers will 'for the challenge presumed to be based off an anti-cheat rating' will go out of their way to produce even more hacks than what they produce now, just to, I suppose, to discredit the rating? Like I should of said, I know that wouldn't happen. As I'm sure you are aware, the number of hacks are generally based on how popular a game is, what platform it plays on, and maybe a few other factors... but I don't want to get off-topic by discussing a tangent.

    As far as ESRB... i think is Federally controlled. There's not much association between what is suggested here and what they do, except that it is a rating system and, they have a logo that gets posted (required).

    ---

    Still seeking information, which has inspired me to clean up our ACO Directory with clearer categories. And Sneaky, they're listed alphabetically... like A, B, C... do you get the point of that?
    What makes you so certain that more hacks wont be made. I can garentee that more hacks are going to be made. How old is cod2. They are still making more hacks for it. The hacks are going to flood more beacuse hackers are already ahead of us. When we get smarter, they get smarter, and right now most are seperate. Whats stopping them from starting to work together and they will out number us. You know how they are smarter then us, well quite simple, look at all the hackers out there that arent caught. They find every crack in our systems before we see them.

    What is the ESRB?

    The Entertainment Software Rating Board (ESRB) is a non-profit, self-regulatory body established in 1994 by the Entertainment Software Association (ESA), formerly known as the Interactive Digital Software Association (IDSA). ESRB assigns computer and video game content ratings, enforces industry-adopted advertising guidelines and helps ensure responsible online privacy practices for the interactive entertainment software industry.
    They are independant but laws and **** help.

    Im saying that this idea is FREAKING AWESOME! but it has that deadly flaw that will end up helping them and not us. We need to make a system that has very few flaws. Combining the ACs to get them under 1 roof should be the goal then we can move this forward.



    Credit to GeneralAce100

    "Step your game up guys... Show me guys that I didn't make a mistake.  Show me that your worth counting on.  Show me that you can do, what we do." - Melfice_Elstang


  14. #14
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    Re: ACO RATING

    thank you for your input



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    Re: ACO RATING

    Some of the comments seem to be pushing this thread off-topic. Discussing other options like 'Combining the ACs to get them under 1 roof should be the goal then we can move this forward' should be posted elsewhere imo because it is my opinion that a rating system does not need permission of other ACO's in order to move forward.

    Regarding the notion that a rating system might actually cause additional hacks to be created just to discredit the rating system can be discussed at a later time, perhaps if and when this idea is further developed, but to 'hit it with a bat' with comments like 'it has a deadly flaw' is imo killing the idea before it has a chance to float. It is my decision alone that further 'kill topic' comments will be considered off-topic and will be deleted. This is so this discussion can move forward towards realization, working out details along the way.

    ---
    On topic:

    Inferno, thanks for your comments. So what again does AA (America's Army) use?

    If AA uses the EULA (End-User License Agreement) as it's rule set for deciding what can't be done to the game, wouldn't that classify the Anticheat for America's Army as a standalone AntiCheat? i.e., it doesn't use PunkBuster or some other software in order to work.

    Blaze, how about DMW, if you're reading this thread?

    Sigurd, GV, GGC, Valve, others?

    Anyone else want to help with the fundamental organization of which AntiCheat solutions work with which fps games? To be honest, this question is something we should have in our ACO Directory anyway, so listing Game/ACheat would be very helpful if only to start it... like we did with our Abbreviation list. We might just start a new thread on this and use it for the rating system.





  16. #16


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    AA uses standard PB protection as a core system, ACI/AON/AASA/etc. as further going ones. Basically PB finds the cheat and kicks the pleyer for it, the ACO's then ban the player as we know it from other games.
    All server side mods (ie your own modified version of PB) is against the AA EULA and thus illegal. Only PB is allowed.

  17. #17


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    http://evenbalance.com/

    Just a note Green, the first one on the list of games they protect is PB.



    Credit to GeneralAce100

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  18. #18
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    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    I don't get this part Inferno:
    All server side mods (ie your own modified version of PB) is against the AA EULA and thus illegal. Only PB is allowed.
    Are you saying that it is illegal to make something like PBBans for the game America's Army? or are you referring to some other type of mod? or, are you saying that no other stand alone anti-cheat is allowed? or, are you saying you can't make a variation of PunkBuster called PunkBuster-typeB? What u saying?

    Just so I'm clear on the specifics, thanks.




  19. #19


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBean HH
    I don't get this part Inferno:
    Are you saying that it is illegal to make something like PBBans for the game America's Army? or are you referring to some other type of mod? or, are you saying that no other stand alone anti-cheat is allowed? or, are you saying you can't make a variation of PunkBuster called PunkBuster-typeB? What u saying?

    Just so I'm clear on the specifics, thanks.

    Hehe OK I'll try to make this clearer.

    Assume, that you as a Server Admin don't like PB, because it MAY just not be the top program. So you say to yourself: "I'm good at programming, I'll make my OWN PB-version, call it BoP." You're obviously allowed to make it, but once you attach it to your server, it becomes illegal.

    Other server side mods would be: One that constantly forceclasses Shotguns. (Which aren't allowed anymore.) Or one which constantly forceclasses. (Which isn't allowed anymore either.)
    And all that without the presence of an admin online. That's a server side mod.

    http://www.hazardaaclan.com/smf/index.php
    This is [Hazzard]Rifle's forum, he made http://www.hazardaaclan.com/history/
    He also made some server side mods, which were made illegal after version 2.5 I think.

    PBBans is external, it is a banlist as far as I know and a Player Info Gathering Tool. THAT ISN'T illegal, as it only uses the Info from streamed logs, it doesn't conflict with the normal running of the server. (Thats the defenition of a serversidemod as far as I know, something that alters the RUNNING of the server from its normal state.

  20. #20


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Like yer idea GB.
    would be a nice feature to help enlighten players on better selecting a game.
    just would have to keep it simple, as in to just stick to what game offers what protection and which ACO supplements to it.

    as far as I know there is soley PB as a core, then PBBANS,AON,Psb and so on workin off
    PB. then there is Valve / Steam...

    DMW, in my understandin, is a paid utility that works on its own. and does not use PB.



    <a href="http://www.pbbans.com"><img src="http://www.pbbans.com/images/userbars/ub_sga.png" alt="PBBans.com" title="Join the live banning revolution today!" border="0"></a>



  21. #21
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    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Thanks TCT DL.

    Yeah, knowing the exact relationship these things have to games is really the trick here, so thanks Inferno for the explanation, really helps...

    I know about mods, like shot-guns only, but that isn't really part of this issue. Still like you mentioned someone might want to make their own anti-cheat mod but again I don't think this is the issue to make this program work.

    It's more about us recognizing which existing AntiCheat solutions already exist and are accepted and noting whether or not a game employs them or not. The more that are employed the better the potential protection (one would assume).

    So TCT DL you are saying really that there is
    PB
    Valve
    DMW
    and all these are stand alone applications, correct?



  22. #22


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBean HH
    So TCT DL you are saying really that there is
    PB
    Valve
    DMW
    and all these are stand alone applications, correct?
    yes as far as i know. but im old and learnin things everyday.
    went to the DMW site and did sum readin, to me it sounds like you pay fer a subscription, then run it off yer pc. also sounds like its their own appt.
    did not read anythin statin that they use PB or any other utility.

    you can also just call me DL :-)

    <a href="http://www.pbbans.com"><img src="http://www.pbbans.com/images/userbars/ub_sga.png" alt="PBBans.com" title="Join the live banning revolution today!" border="0"></a>



  23. #23


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    I have read up on pb and all that it can do. From what I read, PB is integrated into the game itself. It is not its own application. So saying its stand alone, is false. This is also the reason why if you look in program files you wont find a true folder that holds the application, but in the game folder youll see a folder for it. This is also why pb can use its cool little features like PB Player Power. It is apart of the server and makes sure you have the right credits within the game. It was made this way for speed and efficency. If pb gets the same log file as the game at the same time then it is quick. If it had to wait for the log to be written then things like log buffering had to be on immediate and not at the end. It just solves more headaches than a stand alone.

    I do believe that valve is the same but i dont own any valve games. VAC is also the same I think. A2G has a CSS server and if I remember right CSS runs VAC.



    Credit to GeneralAce100

    "Step your game up guys... Show me guys that I didn't make a mistake.  Show me that your worth counting on.  Show me that you can do, what we do." - Melfice_Elstang


  24. #24


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sneaky
    I have read up on pb and all that it can do. From what I read, PB is integrated into the game itself. It is not its own application. So saying its stand alone, is false. This is also the reason why if you look in program files you wont find a true folder that holds the application, but in the game folder youll see a folder for it. This is also why pb can use its cool little features like PB Player Power. It is apart of the server and makes sure you have the right credits within the game. It was made this way for speed and efficency. If pb gets the same log file as the game at the same time then it is quick. If it had to wait for the log to be written then things like log buffering had to be on immediate and not at the end. It just solves more headaches than a stand alone.

    I do believe that valve is the same but i dont own any valve games. VAC is also the same I think. A2G has a CSS server and if I remember right CSS runs VAC.
    yer rite on the money Sneaky, guess the "Stand Alone" Term was used incorrectly. but you dont see any other Main A/C utility being build in the game, "integrated" with the exception of Steam/Vac.
    Am I correct on that?

    <a href="http://www.pbbans.com"><img src="http://www.pbbans.com/images/userbars/ub_sga.png" alt="PBBans.com" title="Join the live banning revolution today!" border="0"></a>



  25. #25
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    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Well that does help a lot. Using the term 'integrated' is certainly more appropriate. But then the question I have is, can a game have more than one integrated AntiCheat solution? But I don't think we can totally throw away the term 'stand-alone' as it represents the individual product. That is,

    -PB is a stand-alone product that is integrated into the game.
    -Valve is a stand-alone product that is integrated into the game.
    -etc.

    I think we'll have to learn more both about individual games and maybe ask a few questions at EvenBalance, to get their help in understanding how it really works, i.e., can multiple 'stand-alone integrated products' work with one game?



  26. #26


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBean HH
    Well that does help a lot. Using the term 'integrated' is certainly more appropriate. But then the question I have is, can a game have more than one integrated AntiCheat solution? But I don't think we can totally throw away the term 'stand-alone' as it represents the individual product. That is,

    -PB is a stand-alone product that is integrated into the game.
    -Valve is a stand-alone product that is integrated into the game.
    -etc.

    I think we'll have to learn more both about individual games and maybe ask a few questions at EvenBalance, to get their help in understanding how it really works, i.e., can multiple 'stand-alone integrated products' work with one game?
    I dont think any game developer will. Think of it this way, we have 1 firewall on a PC. Do we really need another firewall if the 1 we have is really good? My answer would be no. We have countermeasures in places.

    Is PB and all its brother like programs stand alone? In a sense yes, PB itself has 3 processes running at all times. PnkBstrA, PnkBstrB, and PnkBstrS (I believe). The first 2 are the only 2 that can be stopped. The last one integrates itself basically into the system basically making it a must have for the system. This makes sure that if you put ANY cheat or code that could do so can be spotted and you can be banned.

    A friend of mine told a story about being Globally Banned. Which if you dont know, All PB enabled server, no matter what the game, are off limits to him. He joins and he is immediately kicked. He had code that wasnt for cheating personally. He loves taking apart programs and seeing how they really work. Since he also loved games, he took code from real hackers and decompiled it. Now you can say that yes, he was on the good side, but he had code that if compiled was a hack. He tried to get unbanned and they responded back with a similar message to this

    "We do not have to disclose ANY info on where we found this cheat to you or anyone. All this info is kept secret and will never be given out. Your ban sticks PERMANANTLY. Good Day."

    Now if I got you lost, theres a series of levels PB uses.

    Server level - a server bans someone from that server
    Game level - All PB enabled server for this game have this person banned
    Global Ban - All PB enabled servers of any game have this guy banned.

    Game level bans are freaking pain to get rid of and are hard to get unbanned.
    Global Ban, well its time to get a new system and network. There is a 0% chance of getting unbanned. These are not handed out lightly either. I believe they are usally given to hack coders.

    PB has a weird little system. It basically gets the Hardware IDs on your PC and the network. If you have 1 pc banned (i think only on game and global levels) then every pc on your network gets banned. So the cost of getting caught is freaking high. Couple 1000 maybe for the high end stuff.

    PB can do alot of things that are unimaginable when you actually hear about it. If you think its a simple catch a hacker and ban banning system, think again.



    Credit to GeneralAce100

    "Step your game up guys... Show me guys that I didn't make a mistake.  Show me that your worth counting on.  Show me that you can do, what we do." - Melfice_Elstang


  27. #27
    -HH-President GreenBean-HH-'s Avatar
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    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    I'm not sure what to say, either you don't understand the topic, or posted this in the wrong thread. what's being discussed here isn't a new kind of firewall or anti cheat system. This isn't about a new kind of countermeasure either. Your post seems off topic and I say that because it isn't directly related to the discussion, but perhaps I'm wrong and just dont' understand the context of your comment.



  28. #28


    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Quote Originally Posted by GreenBean HH
    I'm not sure what to say, either you don't understand the topic, or posted this in the wrong thread. what's being discussed here isn't a new kind of firewall or anti cheat system. This isn't about a new kind of countermeasure either. Your post seems off topic and I say that because it isn't directly related to the discussion, but perhaps I'm wrong and just dont' understand the context of your comment.
    Im replying to the piece brought up that can a game have multiple integrated ACs

    Then the story was me side tracking. Sorry it was 11:16 pm my time when I wrote that and was tired.



    Credit to GeneralAce100

    "Step your game up guys... Show me guys that I didn't make a mistake.  Show me that your worth counting on.  Show me that you can do, what we do." - Melfice_Elstang


  29. #29
    TRUSTED ASSOCIATE+ !AR!BlackHawk's Avatar
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    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    PunkBuster = Standalone = Lots of third Party's
    DMW = Standalone = No third Party's
    Valve AC = Standalone = 1/2 SECOND Partys (steambans)

    And thats it... apart from the very small non-commerical ac's

  30. #30
    TRUSTED ASSOCIATE+ !AR!BlackHawk's Avatar
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    Re: AntiCheat Protection RATING SYSTEM (APRS)

    Your able to run DMW & PB at the same time (CoD2, and some other games)


    ----

    PB is indeed implanted into the games core.. (but still is a standalown program) (at designing stage) they have access to the game source code ect. Thats why company's don't want to have other AC's work on the game. As it means that they will need to provide the source code of the game (when the game isnt released)

    That means a big/huge risk... costing mils if some idot of the AC company published game content on the web.

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